Russ
----- Original Message -----
From: Randy Sill
To: Titanaircraft@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 1:12 PM
Subject: RE: [Titanaircraft] Re: Winter cockpit heater
I picked up the "Ice Eliminator" from Jabiru USA and it's pretty slick. It
is a dual element heater that bolts to the Bing carb and heats the butterfly
and body preventing ice build-up. You can turn on one element for certain
operations, or both for extreme conditions when it's most likely to be a
problem. Nice thing is it doesn't affect performance like pumping in hot
air...it's simply providing heat to the body. The unit is compact and the
docs say it will support the 912 Bing carbs as well (although I've never
experienced carb ice with the Titan Exhaust being so close to the carbs).
Randy
-----Original Message-----
From: Titanaircraft@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Titanaircraft@yahoogroups.com]
On Behalf Of Russ Berg
Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:35 AM
To: Titanaircraft@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Titanaircraft] Re: Winter cockpit heater
Thanks Tim,
I have made a similar system but no carb heat (hope to do that
electrically). I can adjust the valve between window defrost and cabin
heat. Glad to hear that shutting off the system does not cause problems.
Russ
----- Original Message -----
From: Tim Hansen
To: Titanaircraft@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:05 AM
Subject: Re: [Titanaircraft] Re: Winter cockpit heater
Hello, Russ. Yes, I can shut off both carb and cabin heat. That's the
way I fly it in warm weather. Since the system uses parasitic heat off the
muffler, muffler temperature differences are probably a little bit higher
when the heat system is turned off but there's no way I can check this
unless I put a probe on the muffler...not something I care or need to do. In
any event, the heat sinks inside the heater muff are operating at all times.
If anyone worries about carbon monoxide in the cabin, there are stick-on
detectors available at most any pilot shop.
Tim Hansen
--- On Tue, 10/20/09, Russ Berg <lakenorth@comcast.net> wrote:
From: Russ Berg <lakenorth@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Titanaircraft] Re: Winter cockpit heater
To: Titanaircraft@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tuesday, October 20, 2009, 10:51 AM
Question on your setup Tim: are you able to shut off both the carb and
cabin heat at the same time, and if so, does this cause a problem with
raising the temp of the muffler? Essentially insulating it with the muff?
thanks,
Russ B
----- Original Message -----
From: Tim Hansen
To: Titanaircraft@ yahoogroups. com
Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 10:10 AM
Subject: Re: [Titanaircraft] Re: Winter cockpit heater
David, that's what I use on my Tornado with a Jabiru. A heat muff with
heat sinks inside around the muffler, ducted to a junction box with scat
tubes that gives me either carb heat or cabin heat controled from a knob on
the panel. Only one moving part, which is the damper inside the box
directing heat to one or the other. I can maintain around 60 degrees inside
the cabin on a 30 degree day. Light weight and fairly easy to install.
Tim Hansen
--- On Tue, 10/20/09, David <davidshirar@ rocketmail. com> wrote:
From: David <davidshirar@ rocketmail. com>
Subject: [Titanaircraft] Re: Winter cockpit heater
To: Titanaircraft@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Tuesday, October 20, 2009, 8:56 AM
Hello fellas, im new and have been lurking for a few weeks. after seeing
your post about coolant and oil heaters, the obvious question came to
me...forgive this newbie conceptualization here , but the would it not be as
effective to run a heat transfer type system around one of the exhaust
headers from the bottom and into the cockpit? I mean a system like this gets
heat from a non regulated source and bypasses the need for controls other
than a sort of flue vent of sorts. havent others been using these on other
titan airtcraft as well? :)
David Shirar
--- In Titanaircraft@ yahoogroups. com, Jeff Lewis <jlewis22@.. .> wrote:
>
> Hi Peter, Thank you for taking the time to submit all this great info. I
am in the middle of creating a heating unit for a Rans S-12. Your ideas are
helpful.
>
> Jeff Lewis
> jlewis22@...
> Kennewick Wa
>
>
>
>
> ____________ _________ _________ __
> From: lwoods102 <lwoods102@. ..>
> To: Titanaircraft@ yahoogroups. com
> Sent: Monday, October 19, 2009 4:48:12 PM
> Subject: [Titanaircraft] Re: Winter cockpit heater
>
>
>
> Hi Peter:
>
> Good ideas and thanks for the URL. I had a good, long look at it and
appreciate the reference.
> I came away with good ideas that I will try out.
>
> Best,
> Larry
> --- In Titanaircraft@ yahoogroups. com, "Peter" <pcowan41@ .> wrote:
> >
> >
> > Larry If you look at the Napa 140/BMW thermostat,( see picture in:
http://www.pipcom. com/~cowcam/ ransheat. htm )
> > it accomplishes everything you want in one unit. First it is a bypass
thermostat to handle quick warm up at full flow. With it in the system you
can simply plumb the 5/8 rad across the main lines between the bmw
thermostat and the engine.
> > Yes in one installation I did put in a restricter valve to force more
flow thru the cabin rad but you may find that unnecessary as long as the
overall coolant temp is kept high by the thermostat. In my curent
installation there is no restricter valve and it works fine.
> > One difference between us is that you would have a much longer run to
your cabin heater rad than I do and this may be preventing enough coolant to
flow thru the cabin heater. Is this the case?
> > P
> >
> > -
> > >
> > > The Tornado I work on employs a 582. The 582 has 1 inch diameter
inlets/outlets, as do its rad(s). ROtax wants fairly large volume
circulation and doesn't want the water pump flow restricted in any
consequential way (at least that is what they told me), which means that I
had to try to find a heater core with similar sized inlets/outlets.
> >
> > Why so? Isn't the heater core in parallel with the existing rad?
> >
> > I was not able to find any that were of reasonable size or weight so
settled on one with 5/8ths inch diameter inlets/outlets. To meet the flow
volume requirements, I decided to employ a three way "diverter valve", which
is adjustable via a cable.
> > >
> > > The plumbing is fairly simple.... I put a Tee in the hose leaving
the head (hot coolant) with the diverter valve on one side (to heater) and
the other side plumbed to the rad inlet. From the tee, I necked down to
5/8th inch hose and plumbed to the heater. Like you, I have an additional
tee in the coolant return circuit just upstream from the water pump entry.
This tee provides coolant returning from the heater with access back into
the primary circuit.
> > >
> > > In operation, the coolant warms up quickly (via the bypass circuit
and its thermostat)irrespec tive of valve setting. Once the bypass
thermostat opens up (drop in coolant temp), I open the valve which allows
some hot coolant to flow to the heater. It doesn't take much practice to
quickly get to know where the valve should be set to keep the engine temps
at an appropriate (elevated) temperature. With this setup, I can adjust
flows so that the coolant temperature is close to the upper temperature
limits of the engine, which is best for both the engine and the pilot. (g).
> > >
> > > I really like the diverter valve. It will maintain a constant flow
irrespective of the valve setting if all involved hoses are of the same
diameter. Of course using different sized hoses interferes with this
capability to some extent.
> > >
> > > This year, I intend to find an "inline" thermostat housing that I
will fit in the primary circuit. A high temp thermostat located therein will
open in the presence of excessive engine coolant temperature and open to
feed coolant to the engine .
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Best,
> > > Larry
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In Titanaircraft@ yahoogroups. com, "Peter" <pcowan41@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Larry are you referring to the need for thermostats? I'd be
interested in hearing your comments on the issues.
> > > >
> > > > I fly with both an oil and a coolant thermostat and wouldn't be
without them.
> > > > The coolant thermostat is a BMW bypass unit from NAPA for about
$40 (available in the US only it seems).It has 1 1/4" holes so necking down
is required but it works just fine.
> > > > The oil is a Permacool modified by machining the seat to remove
the notches which allow oil to bypass the cooler when the unit is hot. You
don't want any oil bypassing the cooler when hot. Without this mod you get
hotter temps in summer. The permacool also takes a standard auto thermostat
wax stat so it is easy to increase it from the standard 171 to over 190.
> > > > I just cut in a T into both the coolant lines running to and from
the rad and put the cabin heater core and a valve between the T's. I also
have an outside air inlet ducted to the heater core. The coolant thermostat
takes care of keeping the temp up.
> > > > Peter
> > > >
> > > > --- In Titanaircraft@ yahoogroups. com, "lwoods102" <lwoods102@>
wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Last year, I spent far too much time developing a cockpit heater
system for the Tornado, but the result works well and is not expensive. This
winter, I will add one more improvement (which will keep the engine coolant
temp where it belongs without the pilot having to adjust it manually).
> > > > >
> > > > > What looks like a simple job (simply syphoning off some of the
hot coolant to the heater), is anything but. There are several things that
have to be taken into consideration, especially if you want the engine to
operate at factory-recommended temperatures.
> > > > >
> > > > > Best,
> > > > > Larry
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
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